Land Use: Scammers?

[davido]

This is an email I got today that's worth sharing. You'll have to read it backwards a little bit for the replies to make sense. ~dso





Sam, Mark, and all the rest of us...

I would also urge caution in dealing with this group. It has all the marks of a scam. Why would they solicit monies now, when their proposal has not yet been seen, accepted and approved by the Fed. It may be that they are in this for some quick money and then will evaporate just before some federal agency comes down on this scheme. They are playing on the fears of 4-wheelers, and hoping that we all are so desperate, that we will grasp any, seemingly, straw of safety in accessing our lands. We need to know who these people are by individual name, their past history (any criminal misdoings) and their real-world experience with 4-wheeling.

In any case, it's a bad idea full of BS concepts and tough talk intended to impress us "beer swilling, lazy-brained" 4-wheelers. Don't buy into it. Urge all to resist and write letters/emails to any and all persons concerned with keeping our lands open and free.
----- Original Message -----
From: Sam & Kallene Purl
To: 4Play ; 4x4 And More of Texas ; Austin Four Wheelers ; Austin River Rats 4x4 ; Cliffhangers ; Decatur 4X4 Club ; Concho 4-Wheelers ; Desert Mountain FWD ; Dryland 4x4 Club ; Flatlanders Jeep Club ; Frontier Four Wheelers ; FWD-FWD ; Heartland Off- Road Assn ; Jeep Exclusive ; Jeeps of East Texas ; Jeeps of North Texas ; Jeeps West ; Las Cruces Four Wheel Drive Club ; Lousiana 4x4 ; New Mexico 4-Wheelers ; Oklahoma Trailchasers 4WD ; Rock Garden 4-Wheelers ; San Antonio Jeep Exclusive ; Sandia Jeep Club ; Southern High Rollers ; Southwest Scouts ; Sun Country Jeep Club ; Tejano Four Wheelers ; Texas A&M Off-Road ; Texas Off Road Club ; Texas Rovers Club ; West Texas Jeep Club ; West Texas Outlaws ; Wichita 4x4 Club
Cc: Sam Purl ; Mark Werkmeister ; Terry Rust ; Mark Wolf ; Jerry Ward ; Homer Van Zandt ; Bob Norton ; Rowena Archer ; Charles Johnson ; Rick Neil ; David Ohendalsky
Sent: Thursday, June 06, 2002 9:21 AM
Subject: Fw: Use caution with new group


Just in case any of you didn't get this from Terry Rust: this alert from United's Carla Boucher, along with some comments from Mark Werkmeister. Carla's and Mark's comments prompted me to check the site, as the firearm issue alone gets my attention. What struck me (beyond noticing they slept through English grammar and spelling classes) was the repeated phrase "we must be extremely strict". Someone here has grandiose visions of power! While scanning their "Regulations" I noticed I could be fined $900 for removing my shirt (once common, before middleage spread), another $150 for posting a cardboard sign announcing my campsite to my fellow wheelers!

Sam Purl


I have another issue with this potential program. I already pay for a
permit to use public lands. It can be grouped under a general heading
called "taxes". Until they institute a program that levies an additional
tax on ALL users to support better management of federal lands, I cannot
support anything that singles out OHV travel. If additional "taxes" are
needed to provide better management of federal lands, then the feds had damn
well better stop accumulating even more land they can't appropriately
manage.

Mark

I did a bit more checking on their website and I don't like the proposal AT ALL. They include fines for lots of things that aren't even illegal such as carrying a firearm (not carrying a fire arm illegally, just carrying one at all). This proposal would create a private "police force" to control off-highway activity and give them broad powers to issue fines with no recourse to fight the charges. A horrible idea.

Mark


----- Original Message -----
From: Carla Boucher
To: Delegates@ufwda.org
Sent: Tuesday, June 04, 2002 2:58 PM
Subject: Use caution with new group




A company or program called Superior Trails is developing a permit =
scheme for all federal lands. The company is hoping to get federal =
authorization to institute a mandatory permit costing $35.00 as a =
requirement for all OHV travel on federally-managed lands. The permit =
would be required before any person may travel on federal land using =
four wheel drives, ATVs, or motorcycles. In order to obtain a permit a =
user would be required to take a test and pass it pertaining to =
appropriate mechanical requirements and user ethics. Test taking =
stations would be available at merchants such as auto dealers, parts =
places, and 4x4 shops. =20

In addition to the permit, the company would institute its own law =
enforcement regulations. Fines for violations of the regulations are =
ranging from $900 to $1000 per violation.

I have been discussing the program with one of the partners of the =
company and trying to explain to them the problems associated with this =
system. He has recently informed me that he intends to poll four wheel =
drive clubs to see whether they support the development of such a =
system. =20

One of the initial problems I have with this concept (and I have many =
problems with it right now) is that their website is currently set up to =
allow a user to take the test and if they pass, collect their $35.00 for =
a permit. The website can be viewed at www.superiortrail.com . However, =
until the program is approved legislatively through Congress the money =
you spend on a permit gets you nothing. Also, the website has =
Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ) but it fails to plainly state that this =
program would REQUIRE every motorized user to have one of their permits =
to recreate on federal lands and it fails to indicate that a permit paid =
for now means nothing and the money the user spends to get the permit =
($35.00) gets them nothing, it simply lines the pocket of the company =
developing the program. In short, I have strongly indicated to these =
people my problems with their idea.=20

My concern is that your member clubs will only get a part of the story =
when they are polled for their reaction. Please advise them to proceed =
cautiously with this company and their program and to ask a lot of =
questions if they are polled before taking a position on whether to =
support this program.

Thanks for taking the time to pass this information on to all your =
members.

If you or your clubs have any questions about this program please don't =
hesitate to contact me.

Carla

[Chadnutz]

$900 fine for removing ones shirt? Damn, I'd be short on cash in a hurry.

[Cajun]

The bottom line here is that they're selling a permit to gov't land without the gov'ts backing. What does that mean? That your fancy permit gets you exactly SQUAT! They are banking on this "resolution" or whatever to be passed and their permits the only way anyone can access said gov't land. Until then, the permits aren't worth the paper they're printed on.

This would be like if I was selling permits to get into DavidO's house, but DavidO hadn't given me permission to do so. Sure, you've got a nice permit granting you access, but since it's not from the landowner or an agent of the landowner, it's worthless, and won't save you from CB.:D

[mark]

Don't worry about anything like that ever getting passed by congress. There are too many stakeholders in public lands to expect any of the parties involved (congress, the President, USFS, BLM etc.) to cede their control of these lands to a couple of hacks with a web site. Besides, any proposal like this would trigger immdeitate protests and lawsuits. I haven't looked at the site yet, but if it looks like a rip-off, I'll be sure it has been reported to the proper authorities.

BTW: CB is a sweetheart.

-Mark

[davido]

Shawn Pagan wrote me back and said that a federal authority is investigating them. I thought he said SEC, but that wouldn't make much sense.

Yes, CB is a sweetie, but he almost has the "Chopper, sick balls" command down pat. :D

~dso

[mark]

After a quick review, it is clear that they are only selling a membership to their organization that gets you nothing as far as any federal, state or local agency is concerned. The regulations only apply to their members and are nothing more than club by-laws that are wholly unenforceable.

The wording is such that they want you to believe this "license" will get you special privileges on public lands. This is, of course, not so. My guess is that all you get for joining is a Tread Lightly pamphlet, a Malibu Grand Prix like license (minus picture) and a $35 dollar reduction in your net worth.

If you are stupid, you might just fall for what they are selling. But there appears to be nothing illegal here, just shady.

-Mark

[crawlingno5]

Hunting, trapping, catching, molesting, killing or having in possession any kind of wild animal, bird, or fish, or taking eggs of any such bird.

Molesting?? WTF??

[Ingenloff]

Originally posted by crawlingno5


Molesting?? WTF??


They're probably talking about any form of harassment that would in any way endanger or disturb the animal in its natural habitat...not the type of molestation you may be thinking of (isn't that already illegal in most states?)...

[bigFAWKINranger]

Originally posted by Ingenloff



They're probably talking about any form of harassment that would in any way endanger or disturb the animal in its natural habitat...not the type of molestation you may be thinking of (isn't that already illegal in most states?)...

yup... molesting, you'd be surprised what some ppl will do to avoid feeling lonely. austin did a real number on a dana 60 the other day... can't wait to see what the kid looks like.

i didn't visit the site, but it sounds pretty shady to me and i sincerely doubt anybody SMART enough to be concerned with land usage issues would be DUMB enough to fall victim to this little scheme.