PDA

View Full Version : Dana 44's



Pages : [1] 2

Mud King
04-17-2004, 12:15 PM
I've been wanting to put a Dana 44 under the front end of my truck for a while now but there's never enough time and extreme lack of funds. This summer is looking good though and looks like it will finally happen. I just have a few questions that i thought a few of you guys could help me with. The axle that i think would be a great axle is a 44 out of a wagoneer due to its width but didn't some come with vacuum disconnect and others with lockouts. I just didn't want to get a vacuum axle and then have to put warn hubs on it. Just extra money. I want to replace the rear axle to with a 44 at the same time and get rid of that pencil dick 10 bolt. I was thinkin scout rear end or i guess could get matching rear 44 out of waggy. The thing i have no idea about is springs i have not a clue as to which sporings to run up front. I've seen guys run YJ springs but dont really know. Any comments or advice would help greatly! Thanks

Chadnutz
04-17-2004, 12:24 PM
Which side drop do you have?

I know where a Scout is in town and those have 44s front and rear. It is passenger side drop (psd).

WHOOP to the swap man.

Let us know if you need any help.

Mud King
04-17-2004, 12:31 PM
Naw the scout front end wouldn't work i need driver drop. Thanks for any help. Don't know if ya'll could help when i do it, i'll be doin it this summer in Richmond, southwest part of houston (Katy area). Dont think anyone would want to drive down there.

Violentv8toy
04-17-2004, 01:23 PM
if you want a waggy axle...get an 80s+. They're driver drop. Try stock waggy springs, if not enough lift, go for 44044s. Its not all that expensive if you do the work yourself....i'm not sure how the s10 frame is up front, but your s10 is pretty nice and it would do pretty damn good with a solid axle front. The things that may break the bank are gears and springs and steering arms....other than that its not that much at all.

eight
04-17-2004, 02:31 PM
Yep, Mario covered about all I was gonna say. There's a 80+ waggy at Maldonado's junk yard by Navisota. I think most of the non-vacuum ones were full time so they have drive slugs instead of hubs.

Shaggy
04-17-2004, 02:51 PM
not sure if you would want it but i have full width dana44 w/ EZ locker and 4.88 and a full width 9" with 4.88, detroit locker and chromolly shafts... i went to one ton in my bronco but this would work great in a small truck... if your interested in full widths let me know... i wont give these axles away but i will give you a WAY better deal than they would cost to build

Mud King
04-17-2004, 03:14 PM
Hmmmm. How much would you consider taking for those. That would be tight as hell to have those axles under there. But then i would have to put bushwackers on the fenders to make it look sort of normal. Those wide ass axles under my truck would look goffy as hell but they would be nice axles.

Mud King
04-17-2004, 03:16 PM
On eights comment. I've seen a couple of full time axles and is there any way to put like warn premium hubs on those axles to make them part time? Because thats the axle i would really prefer.

eight
04-17-2004, 06:01 PM
Yep, just take the slug out and put the hub on. No conversion kit or modifying needed, just get some hubs.

Get the full widths. Put some 8" wheels with 4.5" BS on them and it probably won't be too much wider than what you have now. The Ford axles aren't but about 6" wider than waggie axles. You know the wheel mount surface to wheel mount surface width on your axles? The law says you get 3" past the fender or flair, but the policias and inspectioners don't seem to care. And some 36-37" tires would be sweet.

Mud King
04-17-2004, 07:02 PM
Yeah i've seen some s10's with full widths and if the price is right on the axles it seems the thing to do. I want to run 36 swamper radials with plenty room to flex em.

Violentv8toy
04-18-2004, 01:35 AM
Originally posted by eight
Yep, just take the slug out and put the hub on. No conversion kit or modifying needed, just get some hubs.

Get the full widths. Put some 8" wheels with 4.5" BS on them and it probably won't be too much wider than what you have now. The Ford axles aren't but about 6" wider than waggie axles. You know the wheel mount surface to wheel mount surface width on your axles? The law says you get 3" past the fender or flair, but the policias and inspectioners don't seem to care. And some 36-37" tires would be sweet.

just to add to this, if you went with a ford, you'll have a high pinion....but then you'll have a ford axle in a chevy...ahhh choices.

I actually still use the slugs in my axle...they take me about 30 seconds apiece to take out and they're not that bad.

I'd go with fullwidth too...when you get over a 35" tire, you'll rub the spring. (like me)

stinger7401
04-18-2004, 03:50 AM
Glad to see your back in the game man, let me know if you need any sugeestions on the mechanics of anything, I wont be here to help with the actual swap but i can help with knowledge.

Shaggy
04-18-2004, 08:37 AM
** PM me or call my cell and we'll talk about those axles

usmcagg02
04-18-2004, 12:14 PM
Originally posted by Shaggy
** PM me or call my cell and we'll talk about those axles

if that doesnt go through i might be interested in talking to you about those axles.

jerryg79
04-18-2004, 03:14 PM
If you need the ford axle, there was one in dallas in a 78 bronco. They wanted like $120 for it, but you can always talk those guys down.

PS...good to see you are still sticking around, in light of the recent events:D

Mud King
04-18-2004, 06:01 PM
Yeah i didnt think about the tire rubbing problem on the narrow axle. I plan on running 36's so therefore i would have a problem. What if i ran some high negative offset rims to counteract the spring rubbing, but then i would be at the same width of full widths. I just dont want to look goofy as hell sittin all wide with a narrow ass body. But the first thing i have to accomplish is obtaining some money cuz im expecting this to be a major expense before it is all said and done and have it sittin right. Thanks for all the welcome backs it is much appreciated.

Mud King
04-18-2004, 06:03 PM
Whats the name of the place in dallas that had the 44 out of the 78 bronco.

stx4wheeler
04-18-2004, 06:12 PM
keep in mind that the 78-79 bronco axles are coil sprung axles, and if you wanted to run leafs you have to cut the radius arm wedges off the axle and them weld spring pads on, i think it would be a huge pain to convert it to a 78-78 bronco coil sprung front. also most or all rear waggy axles have and off set to them, where the pumpkin is not fully centered. just my .02

bburris
04-18-2004, 06:20 PM
If you find a coil sprung D44 somewhere (like Tate's) then I can swap housing with you. Mine is leaf sprung, but I can reuse the Ford coil buckets and stuff off a coil housing with my suspension. The rear won't be very hard for you to do - new spring perches, adjust the rear driveshaft if needed, and making the brakes work. The front will just take some fab time. You'll have to figure out what leaves you want to use, then fab up a front crossmember (search through Chadnutz's thread to see how his looks) and then some way to mount the rear shackles. Leaves should be pretty easy to mount up, just keep everything square.

You might want to go check out Nix's Ranger for some basic ideas - he used YJ leaves on the front of it, so that may be similar to what you have in mind.

Chadnutz
04-18-2004, 09:01 PM
It does get expensive... Granted I have done more than just the front axle swap....

Make a budget and account for EVERYTHING. Try to have as much done before you start hacking stuff off as possible.

Measure like 100 times.

Mud King
04-19-2004, 12:51 PM
Yeah i've heard that its damn near impossible to grind those wedges used for the coil setup on the coil set up 44. I still keep turning back to the waggy 44. I just think it would look a whole lot better and i would actually have the tires sitting under the fenders. I plan on running 36's so would 4.88's be a good gear choice because this thing is going be driven all the time, i was even thinkin 4.56's but im afraid they would lag too much. Ive been doing someresearch and have found that a lot of guys use dodge dakota springs up front. Ahh another question, ok i get the 44 under there but then the yokes wont match up on my 231 and the 44 or would they. Would you just get a driveshaft made with two different sized yokes. Many questions.

Ben97XJ
04-19-2004, 12:54 PM
I am planning on running 5.13's in my dana44/Nine inch combo With 37's. But then i have a decent overdrive. I definately don't want to have to ever regear the same axles twice. I know a lot of people with 4.56's and 35's who wish they had 4.88's. So i am just going to go 5.13's.

Ben97XJ
04-19-2004, 12:57 PM
If you thinking of 44's read this article It covers everything.Dana 44's (http://77cj.littlekeylime.com/web_rs44.html)

bburris
04-19-2004, 03:19 PM
What engine do you have? I'd assume it's a 4.3, so 4.88s will probably be good for you. I do know that 4.56s with 36s and a 4 cyl isn't enough...

Mud King
04-19-2004, 06:12 PM
yeah its a 4.3 and has been completely redone and has been bored out and has a mild cam in it so its pretty peppy. I have the five speed manual in it bu the fifth gear isnt much of an over drive. I just dont want it rapped out going 70.

Mud King
06-01-2004, 01:38 PM
Ok ive got me an axle its a Dana 44 out of a 85 Wagoneer and everything works great on it. It even still has good brake pads! Went and pulled it from pick a part in houston for a 100 bucks. Gonna start tearing it down and cleaning everything and painting it and have to find me some flat top knuckles for cheap and buy some histeer arms. My dilemma i am having now is as what spring to run up front? I have done a lot of research and am stuck on the idea of waggy springs they seem the best spring to fit. The stock waggy springs were flat so theres no way i would get 36's under there so ive been looking at 44044's but i still dont know if they would be enough lift. I looked at the skyjacker 4in waggy spring and called em and spring rate on those is a 470 which makes me think they would be a little stiff. What do yall think? As for the axle i have to convret it over to spring over and have to weld a spring perch on top of the casting on the housing which am a little unsure about. I want the caster to be right on the axle and dont know what is the best way to get the right caster when welding up the new spring perches? Just getting started guys and have a few questions. Thanks

J Cooper
06-01-2004, 01:53 PM
nick has some 44044's in SA im sure he would sell you. we also have 2 jeeps here with dana 44 spring over convertions and and also a stock pair of 44s sitting in the yard, if you want to look at how and where they were cut down and welded to and all.... dont know how wide your frame is but the springs had to be outboarded 2" on each side to fit over the diff. even with the cutting.

uglyota
06-01-2004, 02:03 PM
did you keep the waggy springs? They'd be a good way to mock everything up, even if they're flat. Then you can bolt the 44044s in to put it 4" higher.
If the 44044s are not arched enough, you're gonna have issues. They're made for like 4" lift on a spring under.
You might want to think about getting some of your lift out of a dropped spring hanger. You'll get more lift than you think out of your outboarded shackle hangers as well.
How did you choose 36s? Mebbe you should work out your suspension to get the geometry correct, see what fits in there and what it ends up looking like, then see how much room you have left for tires. if you can only fit 33s in the end, you'll still have a truck that's twice as capable. If you just have to go bigger, start messing with your spring packs and/or trim your fenders.
my $.02

Chadnutz
06-01-2004, 02:04 PM
I have 44044s in the front of my truck, sprung over, with 36s and POR tends to think it is too tall. Oh well, I don't think it will roll over sitting out in front of the shop as it has for so long now. :flipoff2:

Shaggy
06-01-2004, 02:14 PM
to get your angle right on the axle, place it under the truck with the right pinion angle and tack the new mounts on... then pull the axle and weld the rest up... this seems to be the easiest way and it doesnt require any math

uglyota
06-01-2004, 02:17 PM
at least you've got a good attitude about it :flipoff2:
Don't forget that the "unbiased majority of POR" were the 10 webwheelers who flamed you before you deleted the thread.
but yes, chadwell's rig (soa, outboarded shackles, 44044s) is probably a good example of how tall you would end up if you copied him

Chadnutz
06-01-2004, 02:29 PM
Tate - You are neglecting the fact that this is a front axle and it would throw the steering out of whack unless he turns the inner knuckles. I'd say turn the knuckles to point the pinion towards the front output, then weld em back on and weld the perches flat.

Edited bc I goofed.

eight
06-01-2004, 04:46 PM
Its a waggy axle. Should have enough caster built in to work without turning knuckles. A good level and a protractor will work to set castor. An agle finder would be easier. I'd set it about 5* and look at the pinion angle and if it looks decent, its good. 6* is supposed to be about the standard, many people run less. I have no idea what mine is right now, but when I SOAed the stock front I set it at 5* and it drove good. I'll draw a picture.

uglyota
06-01-2004, 04:48 PM
I'll draw a picture.
this is gonna be good

eight
06-01-2004, 04:53 PM
If pinion angle is unacceptable to you, you can turn castor to less. Probably get away with 2*.

agjohn02
06-01-2004, 11:13 PM
nice drawing. i suddenly got the urge to hold my laptop very still and not shake it while i looked at it though. wierd.

Mud King
06-02-2004, 01:00 AM
Thanks for all the info guys. I cleaned the whole thing up today had a lot of grease and grime on it. Pulled the hubs and rotors off and the bearings looked like they were just recently replaced and everything looks great. Someone had robbed the drive flanges out of the hubs though so i dont really know what originally went in there like snap rings and such but fixin to buy some lockouts for it so that shouldnt be a problem. As for the castor i think im gonna set it up like it was in the waggy and go for 5* castor. Im not gonna mess with rotating the knuckles and stuff. I looked at the pinion angle as it would be stock and doesnt seem to be all that bad, i plan on getting a long travel high angle drive shaft made anyhow. Another thing that is botherin me is i want to make sure that everything is lined up under there when i start welding because it would make me sick if it pulled hard right or dog tracked down the highway. Im guessing the best way to prevent this is to measure from every angle possible and make sure both sides are the same? Thanks

Mud King
06-02-2004, 10:46 PM
Ok who do i need to contact about the 44044 springs that someone has? Are they new?

Violentv8toy
06-03-2004, 11:55 PM
before you go with the 44044s, try the stock waggies. They'll ride damn near flat, have good flex, less memory....plus they're cheaper. I think stock waggies should be plenty....build a small drop hanger and run a 5-6" shackle....if it aint enough, get 44044s.

Also, measure measure measure....tack....measure measure measure...then weld. if you tack it up, sit there for 30 minutes and look at it and make sure every aspect is as you want it.

eight
06-04-2004, 01:15 AM
i plan on getting a long travel high angle drive shaft made anyhow.

By this I hope you mean have someone local make you a square tubing drive shaft or just do it yourself. Don't fall to the marketing, there's nothing special about a high dollar driveshaft.

bburris
06-04-2004, 01:41 AM
If you are thinking about buying a High Angle Driveline then do a search and read about complaints that myself and Troy have had with High Angle shafts. It's all marketing based off the Pirate bulletin board. I don't know of anyone off of Pirate that gives two ****s about High Angle. You can get a shaft made for a lot cheaper by someone local and it'll suit your needs a whole lot better. It can be done on the cheap if you want it to be...

Violentv8toy
06-04-2004, 11:05 PM
i'll make you a square shaft for 25+materials(less than 10 bux)

Graystroke
06-05-2004, 12:26 AM
By this I hope you mean have someone local make you a square tubing drive shaft or just do it yourself. Don't fall to the marketing, there's nothing special about a high dollar driveshaft.

I've been saying this since the 90's :eek: Plenty of shops around the DFW area. Driveshaft King in Fort Worth is good. The one's in BCS I think are even overpriced. Their reasoning is: your **** is broke and it is a long walk to either DFW or Houston...****ers. A drive to houston or DFW would be a good investment.

AgDieseler
06-05-2004, 12:53 AM
Inland Driveline in Dallas does nice, cheap work. Most guys end up using Spicer parts, but Saginaw is just as good, and cheaper in many cases. Both can use the standard 1310, 1330, 1350, 1410 U-joints.

agjohn02
06-05-2004, 04:23 AM
i saw a cool thread on pirate i think it was about using tractor PTO shafts for a front driveshaft. i think the thread was about square ones, so search for that. there was a guy on there saying it was cheap and easy, plus they have tons-o-travel.

eight
06-05-2004, 10:01 AM
Yes you can get a tractor PTO shaft at TSC for about $100. And they do have 2 feet of travel or more sometimes. They don't have any slop in them either. TSC also sells the same splined stock that most bought high travel shafts use. Its about a 1.5" 20 spline shaft and they have the woman ends too. Still cost about the same as the pto shaft though.

Mud King
06-05-2004, 02:52 PM
There's no way in hell i would spend that much money on a drive shaft i meant that i would get that style of drive shaft made. Ive seen those shafts at tsc and often wondered about them, sounds like a really good idea. Im gonna go with the 44044's just need to find some cheap ones. Need to start obtaining all the little detail parts cuz plan on doing this within the next couple of weeks. Ordering my flat top knuckles with highsteer arms pretty soon and gonna start reassemblying the axle.

eight
06-05-2004, 03:31 PM
What you gonna do for a tie rod and drag link? If you want to go with heims I suggest the 122-XMR10-12 and 122-XML10-12 from jegs (http://www.jegs.com/cgi-bin/ncommerce3/ProductDisplay?prrfnbr=91923&prmenbr=361). I used the 3/4x3/4 ones on mine and they run out of misalignment on the drag link.

Mud King
06-05-2004, 06:33 PM
See my plan was to go highsteer and use the factory tie rod that came with the axle and then get a draglink made with heim joints. But then i discovered the reverse highsteer arms where they run the tie rod in the back of the axle and run the draglink in the front i really like this idea, so im leaning towords this right now, but dont know.

Mud King
06-05-2004, 06:46 PM
These are the arms that im thinkin about running.

eight
06-05-2004, 08:07 PM
Why would you want to run the arms in back? You might end up with clearance problems between the tie rod and the motor then, just something to check on before ordering.

Other little things would include brake lines. You should be able to find a few places in houston that can custum build you some as you wait. Cause that's kind of a thing you have to do after the axle is in.

Mud King
06-05-2004, 10:33 PM
Yeah i thought about the brake lines but i dont know how long to get them, it just seems that everything i need has to be gotten once the axle is in there. The reason i wanted to run the tierod in the rear is that im concerned that the draglink will interfere with the tie rod in the front, or i could just run the inverted T style steering where the drag link connects to the highsteer tie rod. I want to choose the right steering setup the first time so i can go ahead and order my highsteer arms but am also in debate to go with al new tierods and draglinks with heim joints but am thinking that will be too expensive? How much does custom tierods and draglinks run or would it be cheaper to just make them myself with DOM and weldin inserts and such?

bburris
06-05-2004, 10:37 PM
It's cheaper to make it yourself. Read around in the 18 steering threads we've had on here to figure out what materials you want to use. If you're going to buy high steer arms why would you run an inverted Y setup? Just buy some Shakerbuilt or similar arms and run them. They're made for what you're trying to do and you shouldn't have problems with them.

Mud King
06-14-2004, 02:02 AM
Started reassembling the axle today and found that the passenger hubs splines are blown so i need a new passenger side hub for 85 Waggy, anybody know of where i could find one of them for cheap. Also wheres a good place to get cheap shackles and like CJ shackle hangers? Thanks Also went ahead and got the 44044's got a deal through a guy at 4wpw for 115 a peice so went with it and they got em to my house the next day, very impressed with the springs and 4wpw.

eight
06-14-2004, 10:06 AM
Don't get CJ front shackel hangers, they're too skinny. CJ rear ones or YJ ones will work.

agjohn02
06-17-2004, 11:25 PM
back to driveshafts. went to tsc today and checked out the pto shafts. $100 will get you half of a shaft. for the whole thing its upwards of $220. that was for the square ones. the spline stock didnt have a price on it and i didnt feel ike lugging the sucker to the front of the store (very beefy) but im sure its more. so, you're getting into the custom driveshaft price range. i dont know how yoke size is denoted but the numbers didnt resemble 1310 at all. not worth it i dont think.

Mud King
06-19-2004, 07:05 PM
Im thinkin about buying the sky hysteer arms but im concerned that they may interfere with the tire or rim because these arms dont taper in at the ends, they are just straight arms. I really like these arms and price but am concerned about the the taper thing do you guys think that the tire interference would be a problem at all?

Violentv8toy
06-19-2004, 10:26 PM
it won't unless you've got some odd backspacing on your wheels.

Chadnutz
06-19-2004, 10:50 PM
Cody makes nice shafts but you have to supply the materials and I think I spent around $75 for the Toy shafts.

http://tamor.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=3388&stc=1

Mud King
06-21-2004, 12:37 AM
For the rod ends i know you need left and right rod ends for the tie rod but do you have to have left and right for the drag link, im assuming yes to make it work. If this is true i would need two left hand and two right hand rod ends total correct? Going with the 122-XMR10-12 AND 122-XML10-12 rod ends seems like the best choice.

Chadnutz
06-21-2004, 05:34 AM
It will make adjustment easier.

Mud King
06-25-2004, 06:50 PM
Well the rear end blew up in my truck today, and i have to find a new rear end with 6 on 5 1/2 bolt patter pronto. I looked at an Isuzu rear end but they are muy expensive it had disc brakes but had terrible ratio, it also had this electric connection on top of the axle that i asumed was a abs sensor or traction sensor, the internals are said to be exactly the same as a normal dana 44. The next option which i prefer is find a dana 44 out of waggy or j truck that is a dana 44, but only problem i cant seem to find out what year model waggy had a centered dana 44 rear, and every picka a part place ive called has the amc 20 rear end. I need to find waggy rear 44 as soon as possible, if any body knows of someplace and or year model i could find please let me know. Thanks

Violentv8toy
06-25-2004, 10:09 PM
its a blessing in disguise.

did you establish whether you were going fullwidth or not?

since u want a 6x5.5 i'm guessing no,
toyota rearend ~58.5"
14B van rearend ~61"

I wouldn't even look at a d44 rearend.

uglyota
06-25-2004, 10:16 PM
Most of the toyota rear ends you will find have 4.10s, and 10-bolts are plentiful if you need higher gearings

eight
06-26-2004, 12:45 AM
The waggy 20 isn't that bad. It has one peice shafts and thicker tubes than a cj one has. The shafts are just smaller than d44, but the carrier and rp are stronger.

Mud King
06-26-2004, 02:02 AM
That 14B rear end out of a van would be pretty badass as the front 44 i got is 60", and is that a full floater 14B and which year vans had that width if you know? And thats 6 lug correct? Thanks

Chadnutz
06-26-2004, 09:52 AM
If you are desperate for an axle to get you going I have my Mazda axle with 4.10s. You can have it... The axle itself looks beefier than a Toyota - especially the center section - but the shaft splines are 10% smaller. I know it would just be temporary, but if that's what you need to get on the road it is yours.

AgDieseler
06-26-2004, 10:17 AM
I have a 14 bolt and 4.10 gears, but it is an 8 lug pattern.

Mud King
06-26-2004, 07:36 PM
Thanks guys i have found a rear dana 44 out of a 88 waggy that im gonna get from a guy in houston on monday, i just dont know what ratio gears to get cuz i will hopefully be running 36's or smaller and am stuck between 4.56 or 4.88, i dont really know which ones to get im afraid that 4.88's will be too tall and afraid that the 4.56's be to sluggish? Dont know?

Violentv8toy
06-26-2004, 10:45 PM
if you've got a 4 speed auto, i'd go with 4.88s. if a 3 speed auto or std. 4.56

AgDieseler
06-27-2004, 09:23 AM
When in doubt, go with more gear. You'll feel it in the seat of your pants.

Mud King
06-28-2004, 12:22 AM
Ive got the 5 speed manual and in the future im gonna put a 5.3 in it so im leaning towards the 4.56's cuz im afraid to 4.88's would be wound up so tight on the highway, i dont want to only be able to 60 before it tops out.

Mud King
06-29-2004, 08:30 PM
Anybody got some 15x8 Aluminum Rims for 6 on 5 1/2" that they want to get rid of i need some bad and fast!

Mud King
07-13-2004, 01:23 PM
Ok got the rear dana 44 in and working except that it has a bent pass. axle shaft but i got one coming. I think i got all my parts together for my front end and will start on it presumably next friday. I went with 1.5" tubing for the steering and i designed some highsteer arms on solid works that i have a guy making for me in arizona. I also went with the heims from jegs that have the 5/8" hole with 3/4" shaft. The only problem i am having is i dont know what size bushings to get for the rodends like what height to allow for the misalignment, i guess ill just have to wait til its in the truck and i see what my angles are, or just guess at it and hope i get the right ones. If anybody has any suggestions please feel free to comment! Thanks

eight
07-13-2004, 03:11 PM
You need at least about 3/8" tall bushings. They're not meant to cause less misalignment, its to space the joint body away from the arm, because the body would hit the arm long before the bolt through the hole would bind on the body. I don't like tall bushings like some use, just order 3/8" or 1/2" tall ones and they'll work. I'm gonna guess with high steer your drag link will be pretty level. If its not, you can use a drop pitman arm.

uglyota
07-13-2004, 04:30 PM
cheapest ones I found were at Crawltech

BigRedFord04
07-13-2004, 05:53 PM
why not just use something like shock bushing sleeves for a 3/4" bolt? same principle and there's not really that much stress on the spacer/washer itself. cut to fit. http://www.texasoffroad.net/albums/lonestar/album230/star_of_david.jpg

Mud King
07-13-2004, 11:20 PM
I will try the shock bushings, they would work temporarily until i find out which ones would be the best, good idea! Thanks!

For mounting the rear shackle hanger i thought of cutting a notch out of the bottom of the frame and welding in a peice of c channel iron to have the mount recessed up into the frame thus reducing the amount of drop the front would have to be? I saw this on another s10 but am wondering the strength it has. Will try to find pic and post it.

Mud King
07-13-2004, 11:26 PM
Heres the shackle idea i had but with regular plate shackles. And cleaned up a bit. Do you think this would be strong enough?

BigRedFord04
07-14-2004, 02:47 AM
that looks like it would be plenty strong, especially with the pieces of plate inside it to mount the shackle too, but i would be leery of the frame bending once you cut the piece out. make sure you have the majority of the weight on both sides of the cut supported on jackstands.

Mud King
08-07-2004, 12:11 AM
Ok here we go, got the rear end put in and drivin, went together suprisingly easy without any problems so i started on the front end tonight, pretty much just had time to get rid of all torsion stuff and a arms tomorrow will do the rest and start measurin everything up. Posted a couple of pics...

Chadnutz
08-07-2004, 02:12 AM
44044s?

Eggsellent. :cheers:

Mud King
08-07-2004, 10:09 AM
yeah theyre 44044s got a pretty good deal on them through 4wpw. 210 delivered.

BigRedFord04
08-07-2004, 02:13 PM
its scary how much that thing looks like nutz pile o' crap at 1st glance. hope you're up to finishing before this thread hits 30 pages, since that seems to be the standard everyone tries NOT to beat.

looks good tho. i like how shiny everything is. mine was that way once.

Graystroke
08-07-2004, 02:36 PM
I think you need some bigger/taller jack stands. Those things look scary. looks like you're making some progress....And please finish this by page ten. I don't want to see pics and engineering drawings of the bolts you bought to attach your new antennae.

Violentv8toy
08-07-2004, 04:52 PM
that stuff looks great! (and fun)

what size tires are you working around?

Mud King
08-08-2004, 12:09 AM
ok heres todays accomplishments, (not much), got most of the ifs mounts removed off the truck and made the sping perches for the front axle and bolted everything to axle spring wise. Slid it under truck to see where everything will be sittin. Tomorrow will try to weld everything up and have it rollin at least. Looks as though its gonna sit pretty tall hoping not too tall, i see now the 36's will be no problem, just hope it all settles down and rides a bit lower than what it looks like it will.

Chadnutz
08-08-2004, 01:48 AM
Slow down damnit. You're making me look slow.

With 44044s it's going to ride really tall, because mine does. If you have a body lift you will need to take it off.

In edit: You do have a body lift, so take it off. It will be the second best thing you ever did to your truck, after putting the axle on.

BigRedFord04
08-08-2004, 09:46 AM
damn....those rims are...

bburris
08-08-2004, 12:01 PM
...about as bling as the wheels you started off with. :flipoff2:

I'll have to dig up a pic of those when I get home...

BigRedFord04
08-08-2004, 01:29 PM
i'll save you the trouble....1st one is stock, my very 1st off-roading adventure in that truck. 2nd is after a body lift, 33"s and BLING! wheels....they were just polished tho, not full chrome like yours his appear to be.

StevenAg03
08-08-2004, 01:48 PM
i bet it got pretty good gas milage in this pic...
http://tamor.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=4033&stc=1

BigRedFord04
08-08-2004, 03:17 PM
if i remember right it was ~15mpg.

but to keep this on topic, it had a Dana 44 front then too...TTB crap, but still...

uglyota
08-08-2004, 03:26 PM
You're making me look slow.
no, you're making you look slow!
:flipoff2:

Man, it looks good! you're making very un-TAMORish progress...
Also, it looks like you're working in a real shop!? You should be doing this on a greasy driveway with beercans lying around and a HOA breathing down your neck!
:D

Mud King
08-09-2004, 02:38 AM
ok tonight was hell, this afternoon finally got to the ppoint where everything needed to be measured up and welded in and this took forever. Little tap here and there and measure measure measure. got the front crossmember positioned perfectly plumb. positioned the axle in there and attempted to position the rear shackle hangers in the right position which was near to impossible. finally gave up on the measurin and put them where they looked like they needed to go and made sure they both lined up the same on both sides. the problem is though that the frame rails arent the same on both sides and on one side the shackle hanger barely grabs the frame so sorta rigged a little support in there to hold it for now. i thihnk i tooka pic of this it was late and took a couple of pics dont know how turned out. everything is tacked up and tomorrow ill get a guy that can really weld, weld it all up... sorry for long post.

BigRedFord04
08-09-2004, 02:55 AM
holy crapsickles! you sure you dont wanna move that rear upper shackle mount back? now, given, i've never setup a leaf spring front, but that shackle angle looks to be WAY to extreme...especially if none of the vehicle weight is on it. BTW...props on getting this far this fast....i looked back, and by page 10 of nutz's thread he was still taking pictures every 5 mins and then asking stupid questions on the internet. :flipoff2: :flipoff2: :flipoff2:

BigRedFord04
08-09-2004, 03:12 AM
vanity plates are :rainbow:

:flipoff2:

cntryboy1865
08-09-2004, 03:14 AM
I think I would move that shackle hanger back some also. also may want to lose that body lift. it looks pretty tall right now.

uglyota
08-09-2004, 08:14 AM
I'd move the spring hanger forward instead, and french the shackle hanger to lose an inch or so...

and CUT THOSE FENDERS!
;)

edit: looks like frenching them really isn't an option, but I'd do a mix of moving spring hanger forward and shackle hanger back...move those wheels forward a bit

Mud King
08-09-2004, 09:43 AM
in those pics all the weight is on the truck that is how they sit goin down the road. And cant move them back because there is no frame rail left to mount to.

Mud King
08-09-2004, 09:59 AM
i dont think im gonna move anything and see how it rides... i have to get some way to level out the back, it needs new springs bad but nobody makes lift rear springs so...

BigRedFord04
08-09-2004, 10:41 AM
And cant move them back because there is no frame rail left to mount to.
where there's a will theres a way. no one said an SAS would be easy, although the 3-4 i've participated in went pretty well....i guess just dont ask nutz....anyway, this is the reason they dont make a kit for this project. its all about kustom fabbing some kludge fuct shat that works. function over form.

cntryboy1865
08-09-2004, 10:43 AM
might see how much it is to get a set made. and if there is no frame further back, just make you some inboard spring bracets. whenever that thing goes up and down the road right now, it the shackle and back of the spring of going to hit your frame.

BigRedFord04
08-09-2004, 10:50 AM
and once those springs settle down the shackle will probably be flat up against the frame. all projects get some sorta hitch. no worries....chadnutz had the same problem...but unfortunately for him fixing it involved adding dual cases to the truck for some reason. you should definately rethink leaving it that way.

Mud King
08-09-2004, 11:31 AM
yes you all are right just went over to move the truck and work on it and jump up and down on the front of it and the shackles collapsed against the frame, the only problem is that those brackets are welded on there pretty good and its gonna be forever tryin to remove them without destrying them, but i guess thats what needs to be done.

uglyota
08-09-2004, 11:33 AM
search here and on pirate for pics of people's inboarded hangers...it's not that big a deal

Chadnutz
08-09-2004, 11:39 AM
Austin - It's a little easier to swap a Ford than a compact truck other than Toyota. You and I both know that so get off your high horse. :flipoff2:

Mud King - I ran into the same problem that you do. I had to move the hanger further forward because the frame was too narrow where I first mounted the shackles. I layed under the truck and stared at the whole picture for so many hours trying to figure out what I was going to do. In the end I took some 4*1/4 angle iron and welded a triangle on the inside for support. Then I welded that to the inside of the frame. Then I took the DOM from All Pro and welded that onto the bottom of the angle once the springs were in the right spot. At full flex the shackle points straight backward, but that hasn't caused any problems so far. After I graduate and get settled in plan to make my own frame to eliminate many of these problems.

I'll find some pictures...

Chadnutz
08-09-2004, 11:48 AM
I had to use duel cases because there was no way I was going to get a driveshaft to make the drop from the front output of the tcase to the yoke on the third member. The case is too close to the axle and it points a little up.

The shackle hanger in early stages.
http://tamor.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=2076&stc=1

Moving the spring hanger forward.
http://tamor.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=2570&stc=1

redcagepatrol
08-09-2004, 01:20 PM
yes you all are right just went over to move the truck and work on it and jump up and down on the front of it and the shackles collapsed against the frame, the only problem is that those brackets are welded on there pretty good and its gonna be forever tryin to remove them without destrying them, but i guess thats what needs to be done.
I will never understand why everyone finds the need to fully weld something up before they put the tires on and check it to make sure it works... I've got two words for you - Tack Welds! They work! :flipoff2:

uglyota
08-09-2004, 01:48 PM
did you say that pic had the truck's weight on it??!!
too freaking tall!
I would lower it or build a really tough cage!

Chadnutz
08-09-2004, 03:52 PM
He can still lose 3" from the body lift.

Mud King
08-10-2004, 01:14 PM
ok im gonna take the body lift off because it is higher than wanted so when it is off the hood will sit about chest high, i think thats a lot better than it is now, havent had time to move the shackle mounts, went and measured a wagoneers mounts from front to back and my mounts are a good three inches to far forward so im gonna move them back three inches i think this will fix that problem. Now the next thing thats on my mind is how im gonna lift the rear to match the front, no one makes lift rear springs so i was wonderin if i could get them rearched and put like a four inch block in there to level it out. The back is a good five inches lower than front. But then im afraid that the driveshaft is gonna run out of slip, its a two piece design. Is it expensive to lengthen a drive shaft like 4 inches?

StevenAg03
08-10-2004, 01:40 PM
ok im gonna take the body lift off because it is higher than wanted so when it is off the hood will sit about chest high, i think thats a lot better than it is now, havent had time to move the shackle mounts, went and measured a wagoneers mounts from front to back and my mounts are a good three inches to far forward so im gonna move them back three inches i think this will fix that problem. Now the next thing thats on my mind is how im gonna lift the rear to match the front, no one makes lift rear springs so i was wonderin if i could get them rearched and put like a four inch block in there to level it out. The back is a good five inches lower than front. But then im afraid that the driveshaft is gonna run out of slip, its a two piece design. Is it expensive to lengthen a drive shaft like 4 inches?

I suggest getting the same 44044's that you have in the front...it will give you a little more wheel base if you want and they are good springs. as for d-shafts being expensive...it is moer expensive to lengthen cause you cant cut and buttweld a extension(can for spares though). i would imagine that you can have one side of the driveshaft lengthen. i know a place in dallas that builds them for 50 plus parts and balances for 50.


EDIT: dont go through all the trouble of modifing it like you are and put blocks in the rear. its a lot easier to redo the rear then it is the front.

Mud King
08-10-2004, 01:49 PM
the rear springs are 54 inches long flat length.

BigRedFord04
08-10-2004, 01:54 PM
Austin - It's a little easier to swap a Ford than a compact truck other than Toyota. You and I both know that so get off your high horse. :flipoff2:
no...i think you're just dumb. we did nix's axle swap in less time than it took to do mine, given, the IFS was already removed, but thats the easy part. I actually think it took just as long to do the full width swap, but still over the course of a weekend. maybe if you kick that lame mule of yours to the curb and get yourself a high horse you'll finish in a timely manner from here on out. :flipoff2:

now that further nutz bashing is done, back to the topic at hand. dont use blocks. i like steve's idea of you getting another set of 44044s. if thats not an option b.c. of price or whatever, find something you can get lift springs for that uses springs that are the same length from one end to the centerpin as yours. then all you have to do is move the rear hanger forward or backwards. we used 12" suburban front lift springs on nix's rear end and just had to move the shackle hanger forward ~6". also double check that they're the same width.

driveshaft king is in dallas and where we took nix's shafts. look 'em up in the phone book. relatively cheap and quick. the 3 times i've had my driveshafts worked on i've used seguin alternator and drivetrain. kinda a weird combination, but they're cheap and were close to where i was living.

BigRedFord04
08-10-2004, 01:57 PM
F150 springs are 52-53". 4wd versions are 3" wide, 2wd versions are 2.5" wide. might be a start.

Chadnutz
08-10-2004, 02:03 PM
Now that I have this up here...
http://www.ultra150.com/images/150-99/ultra99-2.jpg
...my weekends are pretty much booked.

This is my high horse. :D

Too bad it doesn't come with one of these.

http://www.ultra150.com/images/150-99/ultra99-g.jpg

BigRedFord04
08-10-2004, 02:33 PM
no dedication :cheers:

Violentv8toy
08-11-2004, 11:40 PM
I did the same thing....tacked on the shackles....jumped in the driver seat and just my weight alone made the shackles go against the frame.....

1. prepare to move them numerous times

2. tack weld as said before (weld once!!!)

3. hate to be a armchair qb, but early in this thread, i suggested you use some stock waggys....cause due to the design of the frame of the s10s, a sas alone adds alot of height....i don't speak from experience, but just from what i've seen.....if you really had to have 'new' springs, you coulda just went with new waggys from jcwhitney.....i think you'll be battling the height from the springs, and the settling of them versus the shackle angle for a while....its not bad though...looks good. and i also said to keep it as low as possible because its gonna end up higher than you want it....i suggest you get rid of those silly 44044s and go with a stock waggy, fix your shackle hangers, take out the body lift, trim the fenders, and you'll still have plenty of room to run 35-37s.

Mud King
08-13-2004, 01:39 AM
i thinkif i had stock waggys they would bend up because 44044s now with all weight on them are pretty much flat, that front end must be pretty heavy, got everything hooked up like hubs and such and installed a XJ pitman arm due top the funky s10 pitman/tierod end arm. was gonna run 4 inch drop yj but a stock xj is the same and only cost 20 bucks. tomorrow night gonna move mounts back three inches, went and measured a waggy's mounts and mine are three inches to far forward. so gonna do that and hook up steering and hopefully have it drivin by saturday some time, then will level out rear end some how and try to have it completed by friday so can drive it to CS.

StevenAg03
08-13-2004, 06:10 AM
rear is not as heavy as the front of your truck...nor is the rear as heavy as the rear of a wagoneer

BigRedFord04
08-13-2004, 11:12 AM
whoa whoa whoa....setting deadlines already? and soon? wtf? eric was right...i think we need to re-read the TAMOR by-laws and introduce these newbies to the part that says "no project shall be finished in a timely manner". :flipoff2:

good job man. keep up the pace.

J Cooper
08-13-2004, 12:27 PM
you can come help finish the yota since you seem to love working so fast :flipoff2:

Mud King
08-13-2004, 02:16 PM
i gotta have this thing done soon or i wont have anything to drive to CS, its either this or a 73 CJ5 with no top, i like the one with AC better.

Mud King
08-14-2004, 03:14 AM
ok tonights progress, have it drivin tomorrow hopefully.

uglyota
08-14-2004, 06:53 PM
looks muuuuuch better :gigem:

still too tall
ditch the body lift
and keep a prybar handy (or make some anti-inversion shackles)
:D

Mud King
08-15-2004, 01:16 AM
thanks, i put them the same distance as a waggys and the springs havent settled much yet at all and that is also without winch on there, so i think they will eventually settle back a little, hooked up steering tonight and tomorrow bleed brakes and see how she drives.

Mud King
08-15-2004, 12:34 PM
ok got her drivin but has a little bit of bump steer, the shocks that i have on there are pretty wore out and not a good length could this be the problem or should i run a steering stabilizer, steering stabilizers fix bump steer right? its a highsteer set up.

bburris
08-15-2004, 12:46 PM
Post a picture of how it is set up. You may just have an alignment problem. A steering stabilizer will just hide an existing problem, not fix it. New shocks might help, but I doubt they would do much more than just smooth out some of hte harsher bumps.

BigRedFord04
08-15-2004, 01:18 PM
after we finished nix's full width swap the 1st test drive was without any shocks on front. it was crazy steering. after we put shocks on it made a huge difference. got rid of a lot of wobble in the ride and steering.

Graystroke
08-15-2004, 09:21 PM
Some of the bump steer could be from castor, or worn out ball-joints on knuckles, steering slop in the links, joints, or box.

Mud King
08-15-2004, 11:36 PM
i think the shocks are key the ones i was using were maxed out at ride height not allowing the suspension to flex down, i think with proper length shocks it will show great improvement, the steering gear is new, new ball joints, and castor set to 4 degrees like stock waggy, alignment could be off right now the tires are toed in an inch. will post pics when not so tired. thanks

bburris
08-16-2004, 12:17 AM
Shocks that have a little movement will help then...

Mud King
08-18-2004, 09:17 PM
took the truck to a old spring shop in houston to level out the rear end, and they rearched the rear springs and added a few cut springs and put a centerpin through it all, the pictures explain it. Drove it and it seems to drive alright havent had it faster than 30 gets a little squirly with no shocks. I have a couple of questions about shocks though, first off i have the shocks mounted on top of the c casting on the axle which was real temporary and dont like this setuyp at all, going to move them down to tube. Also i know this is driving without shocks but it seems everytime you hit a bump the steering wheel moves erratically from side to side, i am hoping shocks will fix this, i posted pics of the steering setup, the way the shocks will be mounted will have to be on front of the axle, is this alright or will they work better towards the rear of the axle? The tie rod comes real close into contact with the springs when flexed so i think will use taller spacer. WIll post pics any comments or advice greatly appreciated! Also i have always been under the understanding that when mounting shocks the rods are always at top and the bodys on the bottom does this matter? Thanks

BigRedFord04
08-18-2004, 11:38 PM
can you swap the mounting locations of the tie rod and drag link? it'd make life easier on your steering box w/ the force farther away from the pivot point.

also, i run the shocks on the rear of my truck upside down to keep the cylinder up higher and havent had any problems.

when we drove nix's ranger after the full width swap w/o shocks on the front it was squirly and scary. added shocks and it was perfect. you should do this and get back to us.

btw. the way we put shocks on that thing was extremely cheap and easy. found a couple bolts that were the right size to go thru the shock eyes, cut the heads off and welded the remaiing shank to the top of the spring plate, w/ the threads sticking off the side. yeah, it was kinda :rainbow:, but we'd been working 36+ hrs straight and it worked like a charm.

stx4wheeler
08-19-2004, 12:22 AM
yes get shocks on there and most of the bump steer should go away. in that second pick what the heck is that wire going from the reciever hitch to the diff cover????

uglyota
08-19-2004, 09:54 AM
I think the bump steer might have something to do with your draglink angle...looks a little steep to me. Also, can't tell from the photos, but I think if the DL isn't parallel with the tie rod it can cause those issues?
mebbe you need a more dropped pitman

as far as I know you can run any shocks except SkyJackers upside down with no problems. Skyjackers lock up

stx4wheeler
08-19-2004, 11:07 AM
as far as I know you can run any shocks except SkyJackers upside down with no problems. Skyjackers lock up[/QUOTE]

is this the voice of experience here eric???

uglyota
08-19-2004, 11:17 AM
no, but I was thinking about it when I installed mine ;)
you getting into town this weekend?

redcagepatrol
08-19-2004, 11:30 AM
you can't run Rancho's upside down. They devlop like a 2" long dead band where the shock doesn't work

BigRedFord04
08-19-2004, 12:11 PM
you can't run Rancho's upside down. They devlop like a 2" long dead band where the shock doesn't work
too late now. :cool:

Mud King
08-19-2004, 12:57 PM
about that wire yall were talking about, thats a little cable that the plug for the winch cable attaches to, its just hangin there and looks like it hooks to the diff cover. order the shocks today 5012's up front and 5038's in the back, i cant swap positions of DL and TR because of the angle from box to arm, i got a 4 inch drop arm on there now, dont think can drop much more, will wait and see what the shocks do, hoping they will fix it, hoping!! sure they wont though with my luck, gotta move in tomorrow and have to drive damn jeep then come home next week and tie it all together and hopefully drive it back up to CS safely. Thanks for all the help guys appreciate it!

uglyota
08-19-2004, 02:47 PM
about that wire yall were talking about, thats a little cable that the plug for the winch cable attaches to, its just hangin there and looks like it hooks to the diff cover.
my bad, it looked like a break-away trailer brake
edit: looked at the pics again, this wouldn't make much sense, as it's hanging off the front of your truck....that'd be cool to rig one of those to Ugly for flat-towing though! :cool:

i cant swap positions of DL and TR because of the angle from box to arm, i got a 4 inch drop arm on there now, dont think can drop much more, will wait and see what the shocks do, hoping they will fix it, hoping!!
is it still sitting high?
edit after revisiting the pics: yes it is...are those the tires you're gonna run? I wouldn't add spacers to that tie rod...it only has to clear by 1/32 or so...springs don't arch up much that close to the perch. I hope you're running grade 8 bolts!
I would personally feel more comfortable with more bracing/weld holding that crossmember on, too.

bburris
08-19-2004, 05:11 PM
Is there any space to put a pitman arm on with more drop. Your drag link angle looks about like mine does and I know that give me steering problems... It'll look better with no body lift or some 38s. Great job, though. :gigem:

agjohn02
08-19-2004, 05:45 PM
looks good. not to only point out bad things but its constructive criticism. these are just the things i see looking through the infra-stress eyes of an engineer. id look into bending the arms up more instead of using spacers under the heims to clear the springs. spacers put the bolt into bending when the heim directly against the arm would put it into shear stress. another solution, easier no doubt, would be to put a spacer between the arm and knuckle. this wouldnt put the studs in bending since the spacer is beefy enough to allow the clamping force to carry the load. also, the inboard, front, rear spring mounts look like they may cave the frame in at some point. if the gussets extended to the top of the framerail it would alleviate a lot of the bending stress on the inside wall of the framerail. the wall thickness is not that great. i know you said you didnt like the endyoke mounted shocks. i would get rid of those sooner than later. your adding stress to an area already having copious amounts of it. plus, its cast and welding does funny things to cast. id keep an eye on it even after the shocks are gone for cracks and deformation. other than that it looks good.

BigRedFord04
08-19-2004, 06:27 PM
oh yeah...btw....i too think you should reinforce the frame at the rear hangers.

Violentv8toy
08-19-2004, 10:29 PM
dang that looks good.

i'd just leave the shock mounts where they're at....they aint going anywhere....and it keeps them away from rox.

definately wouldn't have rearched the springs though....i doubt you'll get flex out the rear anymore. thats a somewhat steep drag link angle....so i don't know if you'll ever completely get rid of the bumpsteer....i suggest put on some proper shocks with a steering stabilizer (spring plate to tie rod) and learn to live with it.

Mud King
08-19-2004, 10:54 PM
sounds good guys thinks for the help, not gonna be able to work on it til monday or teusday, then hope to tie it all up for now, will take into consideration yalls comments, greatly appreciated! BTW the body lift is off in those pics, and the hood sits about throat high, i dont think its outrageously as tall as it looked like it was gonna be, gonna try to get it drivable and drive it for a while and see how it acts and fix as go along. Thanks all.

Violentv8toy
08-19-2004, 11:04 PM
what size tires are we talking about btw?

37s? 38s?

Mud King
08-19-2004, 11:11 PM
im thinkin 36's maybe 37's if i got the money.

bburris
08-19-2004, 11:38 PM
Oh crap, I didn't realize you had 33s on it until just now. I thought they were 36s for some reason. It looks great, and 36-37s will look even better. Great job.

uglyota
08-20-2004, 09:40 AM
...the hood sits about throat high...
on 33s!
:eek:
Doing the cage next?

Mud King
08-29-2004, 06:46 PM
Ok guys i finally finished the damn truck on friday night, had been workin on it for the past three days from like 10 to midnight, the shocks helped a tremendous amount like a day and night difference. Had to make all new shock mounts for the shocks because with the stock uppers they didnt work right so modified the stock uppers. Bled brakes and drove it friday night and went out and took some pretty rough turns in a fild and found out that the upper shock mounts werent strong enough, they got bent to hell, so pulled it back in a beefed up the mounts, seems to be working ok for now. Drove up here to CS on saturday for its maiden voyage and it drives surprisingly well, besides that it rides like a log wagon from the rear springs being rearched. It has slight bump steer but nothin thats annoying. Driveline has a little vibration right at taking off but goes away after 10 MPH, still needs to have rear drive shaft lengthened that would help alot i think. But i think shes done for a little while still minor things that need attending but nothing thats major. I think it turned out pretty good but i would never do one again. Heres the pics and thanks guys for the help.

J Cooper
08-29-2004, 06:51 PM
kick ass... looks good :gigem:

stx4wheeler
08-29-2004, 06:58 PM
looking real nice man

william_ace
08-29-2004, 07:10 PM
yeah i saw ya drivin around today, looks good bro.

Mud King
08-29-2004, 07:13 PM
Thanks alot guys i appreciate it!

AgDieseler
08-29-2004, 07:24 PM
Awesome work. Notice the drip from the AC condensation - wheelin' in comfort. :gigem:

Shaggy
08-29-2004, 09:52 PM
awsome job man... i cant wait to see it on the trail

Cody_91YJ
08-29-2004, 10:03 PM
look damn good! good job :beer:

usmcagg02
08-29-2004, 11:10 PM
you've got it built, now there's only one thing left to do........break it :gigem:

looks kick ass man!

Graystroke
08-29-2004, 11:26 PM
looks good and only 11 pages! good job!

crawlingno5
08-29-2004, 11:37 PM
now if you just learn how to drive it [/jerry]

agjohn02
08-30-2004, 12:06 AM
that things got mad flex, yo. looks good!


http://tamor.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=4177&stc=1

BigRedFord04
08-30-2004, 01:04 AM
puurrrdy. congrats on finishing in a timely manner. now....BREAK IT! :flipoff2:

FTAco07
08-30-2004, 12:29 PM
saw it at Reed today...looks good

Mud King
08-30-2004, 01:26 PM
yeah im afraid to flex it at all cuz i dont want to BREAK IT, this things got to be me wheels for a while before i start abusing it again. Thanks though guys on compliments and maybe someday i will learn how to drive it! ;)

Chadnutz
08-30-2004, 02:31 PM
Way to make me look bad, ass. It's not easy doing the swap in a shop like mine. :flipoff2:

Look's real nice. Why wouldn't you ever do it again?

P.S. You made it through the hazing, then you did the swap, now you're golden. :beer:

CRaSHnBuRN
08-30-2004, 03:13 PM
Way to make me look bad, ass. It's not easy doing the swap in a shop like mine. :flipoff2:



But its easy to make you look bad nutz :flipoff2: . Hopefully I should be finishing up my hydro assist, as well as some minor welding this weekend, and my will be ready to wheel again (well other than the fact its not running, but that don't worry me). I mean come on nutz, I did a cab swap, tubed the damn thing out, as well as a lot of other ****, and I'm still gonna beat you. Get off that jetski and get back to work :D

CRaSHnBuRN
08-30-2004, 03:16 PM
Oh yeah, I did my SAS in my friend's gravel during the summer with just a torch and an old welder. Nothing like heat stroke, hangovers, and fire ants to make you never want to do a sas again

usmcagg02
08-30-2004, 09:36 PM
It's not easy doing the swap in a shop like mine.

would that be the kinda shop that has a whole bunch of tools? :rolleyes:

BigRedFord04
08-30-2004, 10:47 PM
dont mention the word "tools" around nutz....you dont wanna open that can of worms. :flipoff2:

Fredo
08-31-2004, 12:34 AM
Way to make me look bad, ass. It's not easy doing the swap in a shop like mine. :flipoff2:



It's not like he was even trying to make you look bad, and he did. To be honest, I thought Dillon was going to be a giant toolbag, a Chadnutz II if you will, but he has gained many a cool points with me during this thread. Good bull Dillon...Good Bull. Very nice swap. :beer:

Mud King
09-01-2004, 11:51 AM
Thanks alot guys again i appreciate all of the compliments! Does anybody know how to install gears precisely? Ive got the 4.56's with new carrier and install kit that i need to install in the rear. Drivin around with 3.31's aint much fun, about how to put my foot out and push it off. Thanks

stx4wheeler
09-01-2004, 01:25 PM
saw it today looks good man, have you just not installed the driveshaft yet, or what, also you might think of making some kind of rock ring for your front diff since you dont have any protection for it.

Shaggy
09-01-2004, 02:31 PM
mis-matched gears frick... read damnit

stx4wheeler
09-01-2004, 06:14 PM
i didnt say put it in 4 wheel drive and drive a round in it did i tate, i said why isnt the front drive shaft on there.

Shaggy
09-01-2004, 07:23 PM
why would he put it on if he would just have to take it off to change the gears... makes no sence to me to put it on

uglyota
09-01-2004, 07:29 PM
his front's already set up...the rear needs gears :flipoff2:

Mud King
09-01-2004, 11:46 PM
yeah i have to get a front driveshaft made yet or find a driveshaft for a grand waggy, im just worried about the rear gears for right now so it will be a little more drivable.

Violentv8toy
09-02-2004, 01:38 PM
waggy driveshaft isn't the way to go.

Personally i'd go with a square tube shaft. You'll outflex any shaft out there...(unless you get one of those custom 10" slip shafts)

robertf03
09-02-2004, 02:23 PM
waggy driveshaft isn't the way to go.

Personally i'd go with a square tube shaft. You'll outflex any shaft out there...(unless you get one of those custom 10" slip shafts)

:rolleyes:

bburris
09-02-2004, 02:55 PM
The diff is more or less the pivot point of the suspension. You're not going to outflex a shaft if it's built correctly. I'm still using my stock front shaft with about 8" lift and I can't get it to come close to over-extending. Unless you jump a whole lot and your suspension bottoms out really hard your slip shaft probably isn't going to come out.

uglyota
09-02-2004, 03:08 PM
maybe when you have links or shackle in front, but when you move your spring hanger to the front I think it changes things

bburris
09-02-2004, 03:11 PM
I forgot that he has shackles at the rear of the springs... but I still doubt that he is going to overextend a properly built driveshaft.

eight
09-02-2004, 03:11 PM
He has all the best ingredients for alot of slipp needing. Reverse shackles with arched springs, and front spring eyes higher than the back. When his goes down, it goes forward. When your's goes down, it goes back.

redcagepatrol
09-02-2004, 03:18 PM
just keep one of your front tires on the ground at all times and you won't have a problem :flipoff2:

buy all-pro's kit and make one, they seem to hold up pretty good.

Just DON'T buy a high angle driveline shaft - Troy has had TWO seperate welds fail (during comps I might add) on the comp rig. I had one weld fail on my shaft from him. They should really learn how to weld over there...

Violentv8toy
09-02-2004, 06:10 PM
i guess yall haven't seen the slip in a waggy shaft...not to mention part of the stock waggy shaft is about as big as round as a thumb.

Don't forget 1. where the shackles are 2. how flexy the front is gonna be 3. hes needing a longer front shaft than a jeep would

he's going to need at least 10" of slip. Custom or tube or whatever. When i was running a 6" chevy slip it would come out with no trouble at all.....

Mud King
09-03-2004, 12:54 AM
well great i dont know what to do for a front shaft now!!

Violentv8toy
09-03-2004, 02:27 AM
square.

redcagepatrol
09-03-2004, 08:42 AM
he's going to need at least 10" of slip. Custom or tube or whatever. When i was running a 6" chevy slip it would come out with no trouble at all.....
If you set it up to where you only see about 1" of slip and use the other 5"s you will be fine. There is no way 10"'s of slip will be used. I happen to have a 10" slip shaft and only use 3 to 4 inches on it. My spare is stock (4" slip) and works just fine as long as the length is just right.

pics of my shafts after I broke them both at Katemcy: (I had spares)
http://www.offroadrepublic.com/gallery/view_album.php?set_albumName=albun31&page=2

Violentv8toy
09-03-2004, 01:10 PM
actually with my chevy shaft at ride height, it would either show about 1/2" or fully in depending on how much the locked rear would load up. It slipped out very easily (in about 2 minutes) at alto. There were times that I stuck it back in by jacking up the front end.

Violentv8toy
09-03-2004, 01:13 PM
I think it depends on how long the overall shaft is and the length of shackles. My shaft is 29 inches from joint to joint and it needs 10 inches of slip no doubt. For the rear, I only use about 3 inches of slip.

EDIT: and besides, why would u just have 1" showing? Everytime his truck will go over a speedbump it will bottom out. Thats what broke my cv at alto. The shaft and the suspension will fight during compression. He needs 8-10" of slip.

jerryg79
09-03-2004, 01:38 PM
I think it depends on how long the overall shaft is and the length of shackles. My shaft is 29 inches from joint to joint and it needs 10 inches of slip no doubt. For the rear, I only use about 3 inches of slip.

EDIT: and besides, why would u just have 1" showing? Everytime his truck will go over a speedbump it will bottom out. Thats what broke my cv at alto. The shaft and the suspension will fight during compression. He needs 8-10" of slip.

God your dumb scott :flipoff2:

Fredo
09-03-2004, 02:27 PM
Yeah, what do you know anyway Scott?

Where's brandon when we need him? :)

chevsu
09-07-2004, 11:42 AM
for some odd reason the driveshafts on the chevsu only moved a 1/4'' no matter what. why is that scott? :flipoff2:

uglyota
09-07-2004, 01:06 PM
good geometry? :haha:

redcagepatrol
09-07-2004, 01:11 PM
for some odd reason the driveshafts on the chevsu only moved a 1/4'' no matter what. why is that scott? :flipoff2:
Probably had something to do with the fact that you had a 4-link, and wern't using leafs... I have a stock slip in on my 4-link too and don't use any of it...

1" showing should get you over a speed bump but won't survive if you jump it :flipoff2:

uglyota
09-07-2004, 01:27 PM
I bet I could screw up a 4link bad enough to need a long-travel driveshaft :)

Moose
09-08-2004, 01:28 PM
so how do you determine yoke length? i thought the rule of thumb for a stock rear leaf spring is to have the shaft inside its yoke about half way at ride height. x - z = (1/2)x

redcagepatrol
09-08-2004, 01:41 PM
keep in mid that you always need at least 1" of spline engaged.

Violentv8toy
09-08-2004, 05:18 PM
keep in mind that 44044s are droopy springs. They won't have a whole lot of uptravel.

What I would do (and did) is I'd measure from the pinion yoke to the t-case yoke while its sitting at ride height. Put a hi-lift under the front spring hanger, jack up the front end until the tires are pretty light on the ground. remeasure...

for example, if its 29" at ride height, and 34.5" when its jacked up, safe bet would be that i'd put 10" of travel in it. Its gonna use 5.5" of down slip, and 3"-4" of upslip.
5.5+3.5=9" of travel...make it 10" so you have a 1" cushion.

Make a shaft that is 36" long when fully extended and 26" when collapsed. That means it has 10" of slip, it will accomodate your fully drooped springs, and will accomodate your uptravel too.

I'm pretty positive that your truck needs 10"...if u bring it to the meeting we can bust out the measuring tape and have a look see.

Chadnutz
09-08-2004, 05:24 PM
44044s don't have much uptravel..... :rolleyes: :flipoff2:

http://www.theaggieweb.com/photos/00000678.jpg

http://www.theaggieweb.com/photos/00000523.jpg

eight
09-08-2004, 05:25 PM
Yea nuts that's downtravel.

Violentv8toy
09-08-2004, 07:15 PM
thats alot of downtravel right thur.

Shaggy
09-08-2004, 07:19 PM
damn thing flexes pretty damn good... now only if he would finish it and wheel it

Fredo
09-08-2004, 09:03 PM
44044s don't have much uptravel..... :rolleyes: :flipoff2:



yeah, i see a lot of droop, but no I don't see wheels stuffing up into the wheel wells very far.

BigRedFord04
09-08-2004, 10:07 PM
those are his 31"s, remember he'll be running 36"s. check out how flat the pass side spring is compared to the flexed to sh!t driver's side one.

jerryg79
09-08-2004, 10:17 PM
Back on topic.....

Saw the S-10 at the meeting today, I must say i"m eating crow, VERY IMPRESSIVE! Keep up the good work.

PS...I hear that A&M Consol is giving driver's ed, you should check it out. :flipoff2: :D

JUST KIDDING, once again good work, Keep it up! :gigem:

Mud King
09-09-2004, 12:05 AM
Ill check into that! Also am trying to get job drivin the busses for a&m. Watch out!!!!

StevenAg03
09-09-2004, 01:06 PM
ahhh ****....thats just what we need...another TAMOR member driving busses... :flipoff2: ....that makes how many current and former drivers

Lissa - current
Me - Former driver currently in the shop.
Burris - Former
Oliver - former
Jennifer Pusak - Former
Finerik Juilleson(sp?) - former (you have to be a really old member to remember this guy being in the club

thats six...anyone think of anymore

Chadnutz
09-09-2004, 04:03 PM
Hensel, coon ass.

uglyota
09-09-2004, 04:09 PM
Kate?

Mud King
10-03-2004, 07:02 PM
took a little flex pics today, back has zero flex!!!! must do something about that!! i was pleased with front flex though, thought it flexed quit nicely, nothin popped off and it cycles smooth with no weird sounds...

Moose
10-03-2004, 07:33 PM
nice pics

uglyota
10-04-2004, 09:09 AM
sweet...now it needs bigger shoes!
those 44044s stuff nicely
are your rear shocks limiting droop? You should get them up away from the rocks anyway

TxCruzr
10-04-2004, 11:51 AM
If those are new springs they will suck for a while. Go baja over some speed bumps and over the railroad tracks to break them in quicker, and fill the bed up with something heavy.

Mud King
10-04-2004, 02:21 PM
yeah im thinking about putting a spare tire back under the back end to give it some weight, the front springs are great, but the backs just dont move much, and no the shocks dont limit travel at all they are 5038 ranchos longer than the 5012's and they got about 6 inch up travel and 6 inch down travel if i remember right.

Mud King
10-04-2004, 02:22 PM
also yall think 36's would be too big or should i just stick with 35's?

eight
10-04-2004, 03:59 PM
36s should be fine. Or at least 36x12.5, maybe not something real fat. Get some spare shafts. And weld the u-joint caps in.

JeepsterJayson
10-04-2004, 04:34 PM
Get some spare shafts. And weld the u-joint caps in.
Yeah that way replacing them will be a fun time.
What type of tire do you want to run?
Truck looks nice better start building some protection for the body.

eight
10-04-2004, 04:52 PM
Yeah that way replacing them will be a fun.


3 minutes with a grinder.

Or you could throw them out like everybody that rips ears off.

usmcagg02
10-04-2004, 06:05 PM
3 minutes with a grinder.

Or you could throw them out like everybody that rips ears off.

pretty sure that he already did.

Mud King
10-04-2004, 07:28 PM
i want to run 36x12.50 swamper radials cuz of the price and i like the tire, or if i win lotto 35 MTR's?

eight
10-04-2004, 07:45 PM
Either should be OK. Its possible to break with either too. Mine broke just as often with 35x14.5 SSRs as it does with 36x12.5 cut hummer tires. The SSRs were great on the highway, I ran them unbalanced and they didn't shake, and were very quiet. Much quieter than the worn 35" BFG MTs I had on my dodge at the time.

BigRedFord04
10-07-2004, 08:03 PM
just to throw in my good word for MT/Rs....my 37" MT/Rs were quieter on the road than my 33" KMs. unless you have something else to drive i'd front a little more for the tires that are gonna last longer.

Shaggy
10-07-2004, 08:19 PM
as in the KMs... your mt/rs didnt last too long now did they

Mud King
10-08-2004, 01:45 AM
im thinkin about those maxxis creepy crawlers ive seen a pics of them and they look pretty interesting and they have them in a 36" size. No one else has them so i might try those on. I dont really care about lasting if they last as long as my TSL's ill be pleased. Dont want them to last too long then ill just get tired of the same ol tire, its fun to try different tires out about every year.

Shaggy
10-08-2004, 05:49 AM
may be fun but it aint cheap

uglyota
10-08-2004, 09:28 AM
Get 35" mtrs then...I should be ready for them by then ;)

Mud King
10-12-2004, 09:59 PM
hey guys got a question ive found a EB CV driveshaft on ebay and also a chevy CV driveshaft on ebay they are the same price and not expensive, i will have to retube both for longer slip and to reach. which would you think would be the better buy, are the CVs different for each you think, i just dont know which would be better for the ends....

Violentv8toy
10-13-2004, 12:24 AM
i'd recommend getting a chevy cv that will bolt to your case. Then, get an end for the axle yoke. take it to a shop and have em retube it and put long splines in there....or if u wanna i'll make you a square tube shaft.

BigRedFord04
10-13-2004, 12:33 AM
as in the KMs... your mt/rs didnt last too long now did they
i just saw, or realized what that post was about. i did my SAS and put the 37" MT/Rs on when the odometer read ~123,700....i just took the MT/Rs off less than a month ago, and it just rolled over to 148,000. most of the time i estimated the speedo/odo. to be off by 11-13% which means those tires lasted roughly 27,000 miles. the rears still have ~40% tread left...the fronts went bad b.c. of bad balljoints. they actually did last really well for the kind and size of tire they were.

not trying to start any arguements or call anyone stupid....just doing some math and sharing w/ the class what i learned from my MT/Rs. i didnt realize 'til i started this post just how much i'd gotten out of them.

eight
10-13-2004, 12:38 AM
My dad runs over 60K on every set of BFG MTs he gets. And he doesn't run them below 30%. And that's on a 10000 lb truck, that pulls most of the time. The 35" old style bfgmts I took off dodge had about 70K on them, and were not slick.

BigRedFord04
10-13-2004, 12:44 AM
only other time i've heard of that kinda mileage from a mud tire was on the old school Bridgestone muds, which had the same tread as the pre-KM BFGs. 50,000+ miles on a CC, LB F350 used in a lawn care business.

jerryg79
10-13-2004, 01:07 AM
BDR got like 50-60k out of his 35" old school BFG Muds

robertf03
10-13-2004, 01:16 AM
BDR got like 50-60k out of his 35" old school BFG Muds

I loved those tires :flipoff2:

Mud King
10-13-2004, 11:43 AM
so i should go with the chevy blazer front shaft?

Mud King
11-11-2004, 07:27 PM
I went to BVD today and inquired about lengthening my rear shaft cuz it needs to be a bit longer before i put flexier springs on there i dont want it pulling apart going down highway. Anyways they said it would be 150 retube and balance. is this a good price? i thought was reasonable but havent tried any other place.

i also asked about lengthening a front shaft when i get it, and he said the most slip he could put in it would be 3 inches, told him i would prolly need more than that and he proceeded to tell me that the front end wont move much with the leaf springs i have and that i wouldnt even use all of three inches. guy was a dick thought he knew everything, i asked if he could build a shaft like the following and he said that i was crazy so...

eight
11-11-2004, 08:28 PM
150s high

agjohn02
11-11-2004, 08:31 PM
i dont feel like looking back, im on dial-up... are you reverse shackled? if so, you'll definately need the longer slip. im getting a high angle cv shaft with 12" of slip for my front.

oh, wait, does you picture mean you already got one? you kinda left me hanging there at the end.

150 sounds reasonable according the prices ive gotten from dline shops before.

StevenAg03
11-11-2004, 09:17 PM
i agree that 150 isnt that bad...a driveshaft shop up in dallas quoted me 50 for building, 50 for balancing, and materials. and that tube is expensive.

BigRedFord04
11-11-2004, 10:48 PM
if you're going southwest at all for the holidays, have Seguin Alternator and Drivetrain do it on your way home. i've had my driveshaft re-tubed twice by them (~$50 each time) and they shortened it w/ a different yoke when i put the D60 rear in (~$100). they'll usually do it while you wait. 830.372.5356

I think Driveshaft King here in Dallas charged Adam $100 to lengthen both his ranger driveshafts.

stx4wheeler
11-11-2004, 11:37 PM
if you can wait til thanksgiving and know exactly what you need i can maybe hook you up there is this one guy that does it all at his house, but has all tolls to do it right. to get my rear shortended, and also a different slip yolk with 1350 u joint for my sterling it was only like 50 bucks total with the new joint.

Mud King
11-12-2004, 03:09 AM
ok cool ill wait till i can go to the seguin place or kevin if you say that guy does it good ill definatly try to get him to do it, the guy at BVD was a dick. thanks

Mud King
12-13-2004, 01:43 AM
hey does anybody know where you can get the leaf spring straps that hold the leaves together, do you buys those at auto parts stores or do you make them yourself?

eight
12-13-2004, 11:28 AM
I got some at autozone. They're two plates with a u-bolt to tighten them. I think they were $10 for 2. They can also be used to straighten out bent springs.

Mud King
12-13-2004, 12:56 PM
thanks man im gonna build me some new rear leafs this weekend so the back end of this thing might flex a little.

Mud King
01-26-2005, 04:05 PM
alright i have new little problem the pitman arm nut keeps loosening itself and when you turn the wheel real hard with a lot of force on it you can hear the steering popping. All i have to do is go under there and tighten it and then the steering is all smooth again, but then after a couple of days it loosens itself back off. All that is on there is a big nut and a lock washer. Is there some kind of special nut or lock nut you can get that wont keep backing itself off?

bburris
01-26-2005, 04:38 PM
is the lock washer worn out?