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jerryg79
05-19-2005, 10:36 AM
OK Motor Guru's

Let's say I had a loose budget of around $2500-$3000 bucks (for parts/machine work not included) and I wanted to build a chevy motor making in the neighborhood of 500+ hp (carbed) capable of making around 700+ with the later addition of a blower.

What motor should I start with? 350 or Big Block. All the prices seem to be cheaper for small block, but big blocks are cool. Any special beat-off chevy blocks besides 4 bolt main?

I'm going to piecemeal this thing together as I have the money and eventually drop it in a ****box car or truck.

Basically I want to know what parts I should be on the lookout for as far as heads, block, etc. and what I should budget for pistons/rods, etc.

I want to do the assembly portion myself as I have never done it before and would like to learn.

So what's your recipe (if its not a special secret) :D

Fredo
05-19-2005, 10:56 AM
Step 1: Take budget, throw out window
Step 2: Call Jegs

jerryg79
05-19-2005, 10:59 AM
Step 1: Take budget, throw out window
Step 2: Call Jegs

That's not exactly the info. I was looking for Fred :flipoff2:

Fredo
05-19-2005, 12:01 PM
Well, instead of punching the clown to dreaming up 500hp engines, I'm actually doing work today. I'll come back to this later this afternoon.

jerryg79
05-19-2005, 12:16 PM
How about ths tell me which block you would recommend ie 350,383, 400, 406, etc. and what they came in.

and I will do research, read some books etc, and I will come back to you with my proposal, and you can laugh at me and tell me whether or not its going to work.

PS I did a little punching the clown at lunch and realized that my $3000 is a little obscene and should be upped to about $6k.

Oh and im not really whacking it that much today at work, but I have to take 5 minute breaks every once in a while, you can only stare at a spreadsheet for so long :D

agjohn02
05-19-2005, 12:49 PM
500 horsies with just a carb does not get bumped to 800 with a blower and still run on pump gas, not in a smallblock at least, and smallblocks are sexy. two different beasts inside. got to go back to work but ill antie up my bit after while.

fbronco86
05-19-2005, 01:27 PM
build a chevy 327

BMFScout
05-19-2005, 01:45 PM
http://www.gmpartsdepot.com/product1.aspx?SID=2&Product_ID=460&Category_ID=2

injected w/ a warranty :)

uglyota
05-19-2005, 03:11 PM
Why do you want carbed?
What do you want to put it in?
You want something really fast or something really fun to drive?
Is this going in something you plan to drive a lot?
Will it need to be driveable?
Have you ever driven a car with a turbo?
And finally...why not spend that $$$ on a rig?
(psst...a 383 is a stroked 350)

jerryg79
05-19-2005, 03:19 PM
Why do you want carbed? - simple/cheap
What do you want to put it in? - ****ty car or truck to begin with (psst see above)
You want something really fast or something really fun to drive? - how is there a difference, I want somewhat streetable if thats what your asking
Is this going in something you plan to drive a lot? - nope, as a second car
Will it need to be driveable? no i just want it to look pretty
Have you ever driven a car with a turbo? - who said anything about turbo
And finally...why not spend that $$$ on a rig? - who said i wont get a rig too?
(psst...a 383 is a stroked 350) - no sh!t, psst a 406 is a bored over 400

I want to learn from the build up and have something to show in the end....parts will be collected over time not necessarily all at once

agjohn02
05-19-2005, 03:48 PM
Have you ever driven a car with a turbo?



:gigem:

jerryg79
05-19-2005, 03:55 PM
:gigem:

wtf

mudtoy67
05-19-2005, 04:06 PM
$99 junkyard motor + 400 shot nitrous = 500 hp entertainment.

Fredo
05-19-2005, 04:35 PM
**** the blower. You want a nasty smallblock to run on the street? Do this....

Find a good 400 block
then go here:http://www.strokermotor.com/RA434.htm Go ahead and get p/n IB4342. Good guys, talked to them a couple of times with St.John when he was picking up a couple of motors from them. They are in Dallas.

then go here:http://www.jegs.com/cgi-bin/ncommerce3/ProductDisplay?prrfnbr=293347&prmenbr=361 Get the 210CC heads

Then this cam: Jeg's p/n 249-12-443-8K (k kits are most of the valvetrain included)
and this: 249-4000 Comp Cams Hydra-Rev Kit
and these: 249-4810-8 Comp Cams Guide Plates
and these: 249-1301-16 Comp Roller Rockers
and this : 270-11600-1 Stud Girdles
these: 249-7372-16 Comp Magnum Pushrods
this: 350-2975 Edelbrock Victor Jr.
and this: 132-5423010GC Mighty Demon 850cfm carb.

For everything else, it's fairly straightforward. Good oil pump, good pan, good headers, good exhaust, and a good fuel system. Should make all the power you want.

mudtoy67
05-19-2005, 04:55 PM
**** the blower. You want a nasty smallblock to run on the street? Do this....

Find a good 400 block
then go here:http://www.strokermotor.com/RA434.htm Go ahead and get p/n IB4342. Good guys, talked to them a couple of times with St.John when he was picking up a couple of motors from them. They are in Dallas.

then go here:http://www.jegs.com/cgi-bin/ncommerce3/ProductDisplay?prrfnbr=293347&prmenbr=361 Get the 210CC heads

Then this cam: Jeg's p/n 249-12-443-8K (k kits are most of the valvetrain included)
and this: 249-4000 Comp Cams Hydra-Rev Kit
and these: 249-4810-8 Comp Cams Guide Plates
and these: 249-1301-16 Comp Roller Rockers
and this : 270-11600-1 Stud Girdles
these: 249-7372-16 Comp Magnum Pushrods
this: 350-2975 Edelbrock Victor Jr.
and this: 132-5423010GC Mighty Demon 850cfm carb.

For everything else, it's fairly straightforward. Good oil pump, good pan, good headers, good exhaust, and a good fuel system. Should make all the power you want.


Aren't 400 blocks pretty hard to come by? I thought they had a lot of problems with cracking?

Fredo
05-19-2005, 04:59 PM
Aren't 400 blocks pretty hard to come by? I thought they had a lot of problems with cracking?

Taste Death Live Life! :D

uglyota
05-19-2005, 05:18 PM
Why do you want carbed? - simple/cheap
What do you want to put it in? - ****ty car or truck to begin with (psst see above)
You want something really fast or something really fun to drive? - how is there a difference, I want somewhat streetable if thats what your asking
Is this going in something you plan to drive a lot? - nope, as a second car
Will it need to be driveable? no i just want it to look pretty
Have you ever driven a car with a turbo? - who said anything about turbo
And finally...why not spend that $$$ on a rig? - who said i wont get a rig too?
(psst...a 383 is a stroked 350) - no sh!t, psst a 406 is a bored over 400

I want to learn from the build up and have something to show in the end....parts will be collected over time not necessarily all at once
First of all, I brought up the turbo because if you've never been thrown back in your seat when a turbo gets spooled, you need to try it before going any farther on this
Second, all those questions were things I'd think about when putting together a toy...
The first decision I would make is whether it was going to be a car or a truck. Truck would rule out the turbo, as I don't think I could keep control when the boost hits on a light rearend.
I think what I was gettiing at with really fast vs fun to drive is whether you want something that handles like crap with a monster of a motor, or if instead you should spend more money on suspension and a little less on motor, as well as gearing and building the motor for low-end. I think you'd get a lot more enjoyment out of this, if only because "there will always be someone faster"
oh and :flipoff2:

uglyota
05-19-2005, 05:20 PM
Taste Death Live Life! :D
Live Fast Die Young

mudtoy67
05-19-2005, 05:23 PM
Taste Death Live Life! :D

Yes, o wise one http://www.bensprouse.com/images/smilies/bow.gif

jerryg79
05-19-2005, 05:31 PM
Taste Death Live Life! :D

ski patrol!

robertf03
05-19-2005, 05:32 PM
The first decision I would make is whether it was going to be a car or a truck. Truck would rule out the turbo, as I don't think I could keep control when the boost hits on a light rearend.

oil drum wheelwells and fifties :gigem:

personally I'd just do a cam swap on an amc 401 and call it a day

Jackasic
05-19-2005, 06:08 PM
or put a Paxton on an LS1. If I were you, I would look at a car that already has the right motor: 4th gen, Caprice, or my current fav - Buick Vista Cruiser.

the just tubo the biznich. You might want to start with what you read goal is first: 1/4 mile, track car, weekend cruzer, ect. I know that Anna (Rami's wife) is running a flat 12 with a last gen supra with stock turbos. Or you could do a last gen RX-7 or mid 90 3 series Bimmer with a LS1 sawp.

Sharpe
05-19-2005, 11:26 PM
I looked up parts for a 500 hp 454 that I was thinking about building for me graduation present last year and the total came out to be about $8k with edelbrock MPFI and a 200 hp shot of go-juice. If you dropped the MPFI and nitrous it would be under $6k. I was planning on doing a splayed 4 bolt main, which is stronger than a plain 4 bolt. On the splayed 4 bolt, you start with a normal 2 bolt block and buy the splayed caps made by Milodon. They use the normal inside 2 bolts but the two outside bolts are drilled and tapped at a 45 degree angle, making it much stronger. They make these caps for big or small blocks. I would think trying to get 500 hp out of a small block would sacrifice longevity and reliability. Big blocks are cooler anyway.

davido
05-19-2005, 11:37 PM
Sounds like a money pit. My kind of project. :D


Just some thoughts from what I've seen from mine and other projects. Instead of taking the money you have to start buying parts, you might want to open up a free savings/checking account with that money instead. Then just keep adding to it until you have the money to buy everything you want at once. This will keep your options open.... just in case you run across a good deal on something whole or change your mind about what you want half way through. Not that anyone has ever done that, but you never know.

Graystroke
05-19-2005, 11:49 PM
studebaker 289 bored .060 over comes out to ~298 ci., $600 forged pistons, throw in a Avanti r3 profile cam tube headers, sheet metal intake w/ to 4's, couple of T4 swap meet turbos running around 15 PSI each and you have 700 streetable horsepower.

agjohn02
05-20-2005, 12:56 AM
nothing says, "im a gangsta pimp" like twin turbos. seriously though, its free horsepower. superchargers use energy you've already converted to mechanical energy to drive them. they're parasitic, turbochrging is the way to go. i read a "maximum boost" by corky bell, good read and it inspired me to build a twin turbo dz302 someday. 650 hp on pump gas and 7500 rpm should be easy. as far as building a 500hp sb and bolting a blower on later. it'd be a waste. you have to change too many things, such as compression and cam, to get the full potential of a huffer. you have tio build from the ground up for the induction.

as for a n/a motor, carbed 500 hp will definately be only a weekend driver since your going with a smallblock, which is way pimper than a big block. id stick with a 350 block. if i were you... or me with the money, id do a 383. a n/a motor id like to build is a 396 LT1. it'd make 500 hp and probably still be something you'd like to drive everyday. id have to agree with fred's suggestion, but your definately not going to do that with the budget you mentioned.

here's what i often drool over:
http://www.jegs.com/cgi-bin/ncommerce3/ProductDisplay?prrfnbr=4622&prmenbr=361

stx4wheeler
05-20-2005, 08:29 AM
big blocks are way cooler,imo, but as eric stated i would kinda try to pick out what type of vehicle you want to put this in car vs, truck. I think the truck would be cool build maybe 60-70s chevy or something like that, and possibly a turbo cause that would just be cool, and weight and more tire like flem suggested could be used to help you get and keep traction.

TxCruzr
05-20-2005, 10:30 PM
If your talking about 2500-3000 pounds then maybe...dollars, no...yen, go to a strip bar instead.
Why a bigblock. Small blocks are where its at. Less weight and just as much power. Just tell everyone all you have is a little old SBC. They don't have to know its pumping out 450+HP until you smoke em off the line.

Depending on what your doing it might also be more cost effective to just go with a built crate motor.
Check out this guy http://www.badasscars.com/engineprices/chevsb.html
625hp out of a SB http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/images/smilies/smokin.gif

uglyota
05-21-2005, 12:35 PM
Hijack :flipoff2:
When my chebby's ready for a rebuild, would I see much improvement by replacing my shortblock with a zz4? Would I need a new chip if I put in a 383 shortblock? Other options?

uglyota
06-03-2005, 01:52 PM
just as I was thinking about what a douche you would be to build a motor with nothing to put it in...I started buying stuff for my own
http://i19.ebayimg.com/01/i/04/2e/d9/1e_1_b.JPG
well, half a motor. She'll still be missing 4 cylinders

jerryg79
06-03-2005, 02:08 PM
i've moved on to smaller and faster things....and cheaper too

uglyota
06-03-2005, 02:21 PM
Just cuz your bike has more gears than the other kids' bikes still doesn't make you fast ;)

BMFScout
06-03-2005, 02:39 PM
what if his bike had a motor on it? I think jerry is getting into motorcycles from what I gather. I've got one I will sell you in a few months.

uglyota
06-03-2005, 02:57 PM
I figured that, I was just being a dork.
I bet drifting a bike on icy yankee roads is fun! :D