Building a learning buggy...

[Doug Krebs]

So after a few years of wheeling the blazer I realize it is too big to do serious wheeling with. I love the thing, had a lot of fun with it, and learned alot but I got to thinking this weekend at TCC about what I should get. I'm graduating and in a few months and i'll hopefully will have found a job and have some money.

So I toyed with the idea of getting an economy car and then in a few years getting a brand new diesel for a tow rig and continue wheeling the blazer...

So my new plan, get a used dodge with a cummins and manual. Should be good for reliability and towing.

As far as a new rig... I want to build something that isn't a full blown competion style buggy because i don't know enough. I want to build something where I can learn about bending, suspensions, etc... then down the line build something else.

So here is what i'm thinking:

Axles:

I already have a dana 60 front so i'll use that, throw in some kind of locker and 35 spline the outers. For the rear, i'll just get another 14 bolt, weld it and put disc's on it.

Suspension:

After seeing how the baylor guys truck did this week, I think i'll go with Aerostar springs. I want to play around with 4-links...I don't know crap about them and i want to learn. So i'll do a 4-link front and rear.

Engine, tranny, and t-case:

I'm thinking a 4.3 TBI, SM-465, and a NP-205. I'm set on the manual's after the spring break trip.

Steering:

Crossover and put the tie rod behind the axle and use hydro assist. Probably a chevy box tapped for hydraulic lines like the WTO setup.

Tires and rims:

38.5 or 42 inch TSL's on hummer beadlocks

Wheelbase:

I'm thinking between 100" and 110" seems like a good wheelbase.

Frame:

Tubing....not real sure right now...haven't yet researched this area... But i want to build it to gain experience building and bending!

Those are just the main things i'm thinking about right now, will be a few months before anything at all happens. Constructive criticism is appreciated, but don't overlook the scope of what i'm trying to do. I like chevy engines because I know about them, I don't want to use different axle because I like the strength and I already have the 60. I know they are heavy but i'm not going for competition, I'm going for a strong trail rig that will go most places.

[Krawler68]

If you're gonna run a buggy I highly suggest you stay away from Swampers... the sidewalls are to heavy to flex without the weight of a real rig. I personally think that's why most comp rigs are going to the radials.


I also think you should run an auto... turbo 350... this isn't a rig you have to drive everyday. Not having to grow a third foot will help you out... and not having to gear your rig as low to be effective with a standard will be cheaper.


No problem with the 4 link Idea, but the aerostar coils seem to be a REAL headache. Not many people have great luck with making them do anything other than felx a lot... it's a really low spring rate. I would run TJ coils or EB coils all the way around if that's what you're wanting.

Doug

[Doug Krebs]

As far as the swampers...I'd look into other tires, i just want a taller tire around 40"

I want the standard, I thought it was going to be a pain in the ass switching from the auto to the standard, but the low gear of the sm-465 made it easy. I never really needed to 3 foot it at las cruces...just pull the clutch till it grabbed, let off the brake, and start on the gas. I like not having to worry about my tranny anymore.

I don't know much about any coils so i'm open to idea's there too. I just picked aerostar because i saw them work well this weekend and have heard of people using them before. Also, they are relatively cheap.

Thanks for the advice Doug. - Doug....hehe

[Krawler68]

Most of the 37" radials you would be looking at will be MORE than enough for trail riding... especially if you're going to build your buggy small. I think you'll be suprised how much bigger the 37's feel on a smaller rig. I think you should suck in the width of the D60 with some seriously backspaced rims too. If nothing else groove the hell out of some 16.5" swampers and use heavily backspace hummer wheels.

AS for the tranny... I just think you can pay attention to more **** if you're only having to modulate the throttle and brake. I have a lower gear range than you do and don't think it's really low enough to be effective in a lot of situations. I persoanlly wish I had gone auto on my EB. but I'll be able to make what i have work, and it's simple and easy to fix. just giving my take.

As for the coils... do a little reading on aerostar coils on POR... most post will be people having some serious problems with making them act right.

Doug

[eight]

How about putting a small body on your blazer frame. You've allready got lots of good stuff in there. You could probably hardly get any money for the blazer anyway.

[Krawler68]

remember how much K5 frames flex too... it's just another reason to ditch the driveline into a tube buggy.

Krebs i'll have some pictures of a one-off K5 tube chassis buggy buildup coming around soon... it'll be somethingfor you to look at.

Doug

[Doug Krebs]

I wouldn't ditch the K5...I like driving around and your right...I wouldn't get jack for it. Part of the reason i want to build this is to learn about suspensions and crap, I can read all day long and look at peoples crap, but to learn it better i need to do it.

Also the D-60 is a dodge, so it's 2 inches narrower already.

[Krawler68]

for tube chassis it's notgoing to be narrow enough... I think you'll be suprised how much narrower you'll want to be... most guys in buggies have total widths (Outside tire to outside tire) ranging from 65" ( ) to 76"... your setup will be more like 89" or something ( I can't remember how the calc is done... don't wanna think about it).

I am shooting to always be around 70" total width... it'll sacrifice stability with a full body, but as i get skinnier it will get more and more stable... if i was going to build a buggy I'd try and keep it VERY narrow.

Doug

[StevenAg03]

Originally posted by Krawler68
but as i get skinnier ....

Doug

doug, you dont need to get any skinnier then you already are....if anything you need to gain some weight...

[CRaSHnBuRN]

I talked with the guy about his coils, and he said he liked them, but they were way to soft. I think TJ or cherokee springs are much better. If you want, I'll have a full set of tj springs in a few weeks you can play with.

As for the tranny, I would love an auto. But its hard to beat the reliability of a stick.

As for frame flex, if you kept the frame, and tubed the rest, that would probally eliminate alot of frame flex.

I'll be going buggy myself now that the body is trash. The frame and everything else seems allright. So I'm cutting everything off but the firewall, and tubeing the little beast. I'm thinking of doing something similar to this

http://www.trailtoys.com/geiger/0383.jpg

[BMFScout]

pretty sure the baylor guy had a traingulated three link in the rear, not real sure though..

[mark]

Originally posted by LostIt
I'm thinking of doing something similar to this

http://www.trailtoys.com/geiger/0383.jpg

I saw some guy up here in VA that had done that to his 4Runner. It was an 89 that he rolled, so he cut the body off, built a huge roll cage/"body" for it, slapped an '85 axle under the front and painted the whole damn thing grabber green. Ugly, but effective.

-Mark

[Krawler68]

That guy from Baylor has a better working aerostar setup than most... he is running a "radius arm/linked" setup... I don't think his setup is that bad... just not what I would want. I am not sure I woul REALLY want TJ coils, unless y'all figured a way to capture them at the top and bottom. I hate TJ coils in most apps. The rate is stiffer, but their pigtail design, or lack therof sucks. I would say go with 302 no winch EB coils... they have pigtails at the top and bottom and are easy to mount... in addition to being cheap.

I have a pair of pretty stiff 3" ones if you want to try them.


As for Chris Geiger's buggy... damn that thing is UGLY.

Doug

[CRaSHnBuRN]

Yeah, giegers is kinda ugly, and you should have seen his first attempt at it. It was horrible. But I like certian aspects of it, and with some changes (especially in the front), I think it would make a simple, effective setup. Just got to get me a bender